Balsillie's Back

[RadioGaGa 162]

What I want to see is what happens with a guy like Shane Doan and his "no movement clause." Does a team moving supersede what a traditional "movement" would be considered (i.e. sending a player to the minors/trade)? I wonder if somewhere, the NHL has a definition of what a "no movement clause" is...

If they don't...they will *L*

[Krev 86]

What I want to see is what happens with a guy like Shane Doan and his "no movement clause." Does a team moving supersede what a traditional "movement" would be considered (i.e. sending a player to the minors/trade)? I wonder if somewhere, the NHL has a definition of what a "no movement clause" is...

If they don't...they will *L*

Isn't it just a transfer of the rights to a player from club to club? Like when the North Stars moved to Dallas, the rights to all the players were transfered to the new club, and then the contracts could be negotiated with the new club.

[Krev 86]

I'm very aware they didn't just 'move', I've followed Dallas for years. It's just easier to say they moved for the sake of keeping this conversation moving along.

Actually, the North Stars didn't just move to Dallas. That was when San Jose came into the league and players were split between the two teams.

Also, I don't believe "no movement clauses" were around in those days. It certainly shows how far sports have come as a business between individual players and the team they play for.

Isn't it just a transfer of the rights to a player from club to club? Like when the North Stars moved to Dallas, the rights to all the players were transfered to the new club, and then the contracts could be negotiated with the new club.

Edit: Gah, you and your editing of your posts. :P

[Chadd 916]

Also, wondering how did you came up with your numbers? Toronto is far closer to Hamilton than Buffalo is; 68km from Hamilton to the ACC versus 106km on Hamilton to Buffalo. Why would you think Buffalo should get more? Just curious.

Pulled the numbers out of my ass, but I think Buffalo will be hurt by this more than the Leafs. Toronto has thousands of people waiting in line for tickets, Buffalo does not. Ergo, Buffalo will be more significantly impacted by the move than the Leafs and should be compensated as such. I have no problem with bigger numbers, I just think protecting/compensating the Sabres should be the first consideration if the team is permitted to move.

[vek 0]

I think the NHL, between relocation and indemnification fees, will put the number at over $200 million USD.

Even at that number, Balsille will turn a profit fairly quickly. Southern Ontario will throw all kinds of money at a new team. Heck, they could probably support two added teams, and make them all some of the most profitable in the NHL.

Regarding Buffalo, I'm suprised that Canadians represent so much ticket sales there that would make a Hamilton venture risk the Sabres franchise. The only time I hear of people heading over is for a Leafs road game. Considering how much of a pain it can be to cross the border these days, I'd wager that if Buffalo is counting on Canadian dollars to prop them up, they're in serious trouble already.

[mack 44]

What hurts more than anything financial for Toronto is that a shitty team would be moving in and be better than they are immediately.

[Chadd 916]

Pulling numbers out of your ass doesn't cut it and you'd tell anyone else on this BB that. I thought you were better than that Chadd...

It was an example and I thought it was pretty clear that is was a number used simply as a way to show that it was unlikely that Balsillie would be willing to pay the fees in addition to the purchase price. Your proposed numbers make it even more unlikely.

[Neal 41]

So if I'm doing the math right Balsillie is looking at $212 to buy the Coyotes, a $100M relocation fee, $120M to the Leafs for lost revenue + some amount to Buffalo, lets say $50M for a total of $482M.

The Canadiens are for sale and rumored to be asking in the $400-$450M range. How can the NHL, the Leafs and the Sabres claim a franchise in Hamilton/Southern Ontario is worth more than the most storied franchise in the entire league.

I'm confident Hamilton/Southern Ontario could support an NHL team, but I'm just a little more confident Montreal can. How can a proven, prestige franchise be worth less than a perennial loser moving into an unproven fanbase?

[Neal 41]

Neither am I, but to the majority of people who are happily uneducated in the bankruptcy process for commercial entities isn't that the immediate and kinda logical comparison?

[RadioGaGa 162]

To quote Porky Pig:

"...that's all folks!"

http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=281971

[DarkStar50 679]

If the judge can't make the time, he should find the time. Oh well, Bettman and the Leafs hold the hammer, no doubt.

[jds 20]

Goddamn it!

[RadioGaGa 162]

So, I wonder if that rally they had planned in Hamilton will still be a go *L*

[RiSeOnFiRe 0]

So now what?

Someone with less money will buy the Coyotes, loose millions next season, and the season after that, AND the season after that. The team might make a few playoff appearances in the coming years, but even that wont save them. Finally they will ask to move the team and all this fucking time and wasted money could have been saved by just giving JB his team.

Just because your 'right' in an argument, doesn't mean you should win it.

[Chadd 916]

To quote Porky Pig:

"...that's all folks!"

http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=281971

If the article is accurate, the judge simply passed the buck on all of the tough decisions. Either way, Balsillie did two things; made himself a cult hero in Canada and made the NHL look bad to the public. Both of those things will comfort him greatly after the loss.

[top 1974 0]

Bettman/NHL must know that after 13 or so seasons and 300 million + lost, the Coyotes are not viable in Phoenix. I agree with an earlier poster that we'll see another couple of poor revenue/loosing seasons from the Coyotes. Bettman knows the Phoenix situation has to be resolved by the 2011-12 season when the CBA between the NHL and NHLPA is open for renegotiation. Proping up the Coyotes takes away from league revenues. Now that player salaries are tied to league revenues, I'll bet the NHLPA will not have the patience for this to continue. Paul Kelly has made his thoughts known regarding the Coyotes when he said to pull the plug on the team.

The timing couldnt be better either. It is predicted the salary cap will be stable for next season (2009-2010), but is likely to be reduced for the following two seasons after next - inclusing the 2011-2012 season. With players likely having to take a cut, or play an extended period in the minors (A la Philadelphia Flyers), they will push hard for profitable franchises and begin to question the NHL stance on the Phoenix situation.

[RecLeagueHero 0]

They are as viable in Phoenix as they are anywhere else. The bottom line is you put a winning team on the ice and you'll put asses in the stands. You put a loosing team on the ice and no one shows up, unless you're as lucky as the Maple Leafs. But let's be realistic, that is an aberration in the world of pro sports. Fans will forgive loosing rebuilding seasons, they won't forgive season after season of failure.

There are NHL teams in Phoenix and Denver because the equation that "Canada + Hockey = Can't fail" is false. It's easy to get people in Hamilton to show up to rallies, it'd be easy to get people in Winnipeg all pumped up if you told them they might get the Jets back if everyone makes picket signs and shows up for a march. It's a vastly different story when it's time for those same people to pull out the debt card and pay for season tickets.

[RadioGaGa 162]

The "Make It Seven" rally is going on at Copps Friday in spite of the recent set back. I will be very interested to see how many people show up.

[K9 Unit 1]

i just want to watch hockey with cheaper tickets...radio~ go for me would ya? :P

[RadioGaGa 162]

i just want to watch hockey with cheaper tickets...radio~ go for me would ya? :P

We're sending some people down from the station...but I'm going to be too busy Friday to go down. I took time off to go to the Bulldogs rally...when they WON. You know that PRO hockey team...that Hamilton ALREADY has!!!!

This (IMO) is going to be a foolish display by a very (very) small group!

[RadioGaGa 162]

This (IMO) is going to be a foolish display by a very (very) small group!

Well...I stand corrected...kinda. About 3500 showed up.

[K9 Unit 1]

oh haha...what they do just sit there with signs?

[RadioGaGa 162]

oh haha...what they do just sit there with signs?

I didn't go but from people who did...there were speeches from all involved...the City, the Ballzy guys...some of the sponsors. Lots of "Go Jim Go" chants...There were the typical signs:

"We deserve a Team"

"Bring the NHL to Hamilton"

But...the Bulldogs Booster Club was there with their signs:

"Hamilton already has Pro Hockey"

stuff like that.

Realistically...to really prove/show anything...I think they needed to have enough people there to at least FILL Copps (17,000+) anything less than that doesn't prove much.

[K9 Unit 1]

oh haha...can't believe there were speeches was it even on the news? lol

[RadioGaGa 162]

oh haha...can't believe there were speeches was it even on the news? lol

We (Talk 820) had stuff going on all day about it...a few calling in reports from the event. Didn't actually carry any of the speeches or anything...CH News had it as the lead at noon...not sure what they did in the evening news package.

The Spec had some peopel there as well.