Virginia Tech STAR rating system being developed for hockey helmets

[EBondo 232]

If it lessens the sting, chances are the first time around the mum was probably just as rash in purchasing a helmet, might of been a $300 helmet that doesn't fit much better than the krown. so at the least she's buying something, apples to apples, that is probably safer.

i would think buying a helmet that might not fit but rated safer by one study is better than buying a stupidly expensive helmet that might not fit, but is expensive and accordingly to a manufacturer means its safer. but again, this study isn't written law yet.

Would it surprise you if not even two weeks ago, she purchased said $300 dollar helmet?

[chippa13 1844]

A helmet that doesn't fit is not a better alternative, regardless of how well it is supposedly rated.

The problem I have is that these "results" are public without being validated and now people are going to make potentially bad decisions based on them.

[DarkStar50 679]

I'm not advocating EPP as the be-all end-all for interior foam lining but isn't a problem with VN foam that it truly has a limited shelf life? The softer VN foam will eventually harden over time and very few people pay attention to replacing their helmet as a foam hardens. Hell, very few people pay any attention at all to their helmet as we are constantly replacing screws, missing dome screws, etc., all the time in the Pro Shop. Also, with VN, what about the effects of temperature on the foam? Hockey is a cold weather sport and your gear is usually in the back of your car trunk getting cold on the ride to the rink. The VN needs to warm up to feel soft again. Finally, NHL teams replace their helmets often in season, especially their road helmets as I understand that air travel effects the life of the helmets from high altitude pressure and temperatures. We will have to see the results of the 4500 helmet to gauge the effectiveness of VN foam.

[Caihlen 67]

Up to this point the discussion has focused on the 3 star helmet and fitting issues. Hypothetically, what would you do if you had one of the helmets that was rated a 0? Would you, based on the data that is available as of this instant, go out and buy a 2 star rated helmet? I only mention 2 star because in a perfunctory search, Warrior Krown 360's have suddenly become very scarce.

[fcalog 58]

Up to this point the discussion has focused on the 3 star helmet and fitting issues. Hypothetically, what would you do if you had one of the helmets that was rated a 0? Would you, based on the data that is available as of this instant, go out and buy a 2 star rated helmet? I only mention 2 star because in a perfunctory search, Warrior Krown 360's have suddenly become very scarce.

They were/are on clearance. Maybe Warrior will reassess and restart production to meet the demand.

[EBondo 232]

A helmet that doesn't fit is not a better alternative, regardless of how well it is supposedly rated.

The problem I have is that these "results" are public without being validated and now people are going to make potentially bad decisions based on them.

This is my biggest issue with these results. I mean, look at the #6 helmet on that list, the 2100. I have a hard, hard time believing anyone is recommending the helmet to the travel hockey player. There's simply nothing to the helmet.

Up to this point the discussion has focused on the 3 star helmet and fitting issues. Hypothetically, what would you do if you had one of the helmets that was rated a 0? Would you, based on the data that is available as of this instant, go out and buy a 2 star rated helmet? I only mention 2 star because in a perfunctory search, Warrior Krown 360's have suddenly become very scarce.

This will be interesting to see as well.

I've worn four of the helmets listed on this "ranking," the Re-Akt, the Re-Akt 100, the 4500 and currently the V08. Of all of these helmets, the V08 fits me the best, by far.

JunkyardAthletic

With that said, perception is reality and the short term reality is that the days of poor fitting helmets are here, as has been reported by a few here, parents are already carrying the article into stores.

And it sucks as an employee who simply wants to put the player in the best-fitting helmet.

Edited March 31, 2015 by EBondo

[JR Boucicaut 3793]

They were/are on clearance. Maybe Warrior will reassess and restart production to meet the demand.

They have a new helmet with the same shell that will come out this summer.

[fcalog 58]

They have a new helmet with the same shell that will come out this summer.

It will have to be tested with no guarantee that it will achieve it's predecessor's 3 star status. One would have thought that the Krown LTE which shares many of the features of the 360 would be comparable.

[JR Boucicaut 3793]

The only difference between the 360 and LTE is now back in the new helmet, albeit in a slimmer package.

[JR Boucicaut 3793]

Bauer has officially responded to the findings -

http://www.bauer.com/helmets

[215BroadStBullies610 435]

From what I've observed from my short time officiating, I'd say some of the concussions are attributable to bad technique. Whether it is someone throwing a check or puck-handling through the neutral zone, it seems that no one holds the players or the coaches in any of this. It can't be all the equipment's fault. Interesting read nonetheless.

[goblue9280 33]

A helmet that doesn't fit is not a better alternative, regardless of how well it is supposedly rated.

The problem I have is that these "results" are public without being validated and now people are going to make potentially bad decisions based on them.

That's not accurate, while it varies by journal, most all have a significant review process before being accepted for publication. The Annals of Biomedical Engineering is the official journal of the Biomedical Engineering Society... it's a very well regarded engineering society, so I would think their journal review process is significant.

Bauer has officially responded to the findings -

http://www.bauer.com/helmets

"We caution the hockey community against simply accepting Virginia Tech’s statement that hockey helmets are not safe and its conclusion that players should expect to sustain a certain number of concussions per season, depending upon the type of helmet that they wear."

Come on Bauer, lol, if you have 100's of engineers and multiple experts working on helmet R&D, you should be able to read a rather standard results summary release and realize that Virginia Tech came to NEITHER of the above conclusions.

[raganblink 82]

Its all about saving face.

I've had multiple people ask about the Krown 360 - I bet Warrior, Peranis & Hockey Money are loving this - they'll finally be able to get rid of those buckets that didn't sell and broke easily.

With the testing they've done - we haven't had time to examine their methods, but based on the short video ESPN had - to me it seems a little flawed. Looked the same as football testing, which we know is not the same as hockey, as hockey has much more linear impacts rather than straight on (the reason why Bauer & CCM have spent millions of dollars in R&D on protecting against linear impacts).

Its also interesting that helmets, with the same interiors are rated different with their shell being the only difference. Further what is the difference between their star ratings? Is something a high 1 star that was almost a 2, or was one a low 1 star that almost was not recommended? What do they constitute a 4 or 5 star helmet? Once we have those parameters than the companies can design a helmet that fits that mold, but again, would it be too heavy of a helmet and therefore cause whiplash issues, especially on those who do not have strong neck muscles?

Lastly, the video by ESPN is ridiculous - girl in a helmet that wasn't produced for several years before she bought it, then her cage is too large and has no jclips, and lastly, is she still using a helmet that she got a concussion in? Uhh talk about bad parenting. If I have children who play hockey, I'll be buying them a new helmet seasonly. You don't know what kind of fractures have happened in that helmet, and the constant expanding and contracting of the interior cannot be a good thing.

[Cosmic 178]

I know it's about fit and head shape, but I and everyone I know who has ever tried on the Warrior helmets have found them to be so uncomfortable and pinchy up top/ in the top back. We all have pretty standard'ish heads too (I think, anyway, as we all fit fine in Missions and Bauers and Reebok/ CCM). Not sure who the head model is for Warrior, but whoever it is may have a bit oddly shaped noggin. I know Keith is on here and a contributing member- not knockin your company bud- love the gloves and sticks (and wear pro stock Franchises- don't love them but they are definitely well made) and will likely grab the Dynasty girdle (or MX3 maybe, we will see), but I think that may be the reason that the helmets are not exactly flying off the shelves (well, until now with the VT report).

Edited March 31, 2015 by Cosmic

[hawkeyfan 36]

I saw this on ESPN yesterday and thought of posting it.

I have alwys understood the issue with Fit, since my sons 1st helmet gave him issues and I've watched many other kids have the fit issue as well.

I have never liked the EPP foam as a comfortable liner, BUT it does show someone to get a new helmet if they take a hit and the foam liner breaks from the impact. The user will know they need to be checked out and they need a new helmet (oh and its light)

Before this study the NEWer CCM Resistance 300 and the Warrior have been at the top of the list for any helmet purchases...We'll see...I am awaiting the Warrior catalog release to see what they have next...But this helps with the newer CCM models

Oh I also ment tto include...What does this mean...More expensive helmets are on their way. No one is going to design a newer hlmet and not capitalize on the market, reguardless of the cost of manufacturing the product.

[Chadd 916]

exactly, and that is the key. Maybe based on these studies, a materials engineer will have an idea for something new they could put into helmets to make them even safer, or some other professor at another university will come up with ideas that can make the testing itself even more refined.

Maybe someone will design a helmet with Zorbium padding..........

[ulf 5]

good news is that bauer should be ramping up for improved safety because of this report

whether it's a modification of the re-akt or a new helmet altogether..or both

i think a third party safety co. should test every manufactures helmet

[chippa13 1844]

Anyone else see the irony of a user named "Ulf" with Samuelsson's picture clamoring for safety in hockey?

[goblue9280 33]

Anyone else see the irony of a user named "Ulf" with Samuelsson's picture clamoring for safety in hockey?

[Buzz_LightBeer 969]

good news is that bauer should be ramping up for improved safety because of this report

I bet Bauer is more likely to acknowledge the VT study and continue their innovation/safety process as usual. Just the random nature of the helmets they deem "safest" should indicate to a hockey knowledgable person that the VT system is not perfect. Is your head just as safe in the same hit wearing a Res300 as a 2100? Unlikely, but this system says yes.

[HDHockey 19]

USA Hockey posted a reply to the study today

http://www.usahockey.com/news_article/show/498353?referrer_id=1093254

[mojo122 535]

I don't have a problem with the way VT did the testing but do take exception to their inference that every player suffers a number of concussions each season. That's what sets the fear of every parent in motion. My hope is that studies like this help direct the R & D to further improvements, which as a consumer I have confidence that it will. What will probably not change is that you will continue to have those customers that:

1) Will buy the most expensive helmet regardless of fit because it must be the most protective based on the price tag.

2) Will buy the cheapest helmet regardless of fit because they do not want to spend money on a helmet

3) Will buy the one that they think they look better in regardless or price and fit.

Retailers should just stick with recommending helmet based on fit and hope the consumer takes the information presented into their decision making process.

[DarkStar50 679]

I give credit to Dr. Stuart at USA Hockey for clearly writing a review of a few of the inconsistencies in the STAR rating system. Unfortunately, ESPN has let the horse out of the barn with their article.

[oldtrainerguy28 478]

I give credit to Dr. Stuart at USA Hockey for clearly writing a review of a few of the inconsistencies in the STAR rating system. Unfortunately, ESPN has let the horse out of the barn with their article.

I agree. Very well written and backed up response.

[chippa13 1844]

He wasn't pointing out inconsistencies so much as he was indicating deficiencies.