JR Boucicaut 3789 Report post Posted July 23, 2018 1 hour ago, BlueNux said: So they don’t adjust the instep depth/volume? I was under the assumption that a true custom skate would customize everything, from width, instep depth, etc. I’m in supremes now and they still have the metatarsal guard dig into the top of my foot and I fail the pencil test a bit. I swim in Nexus. It'll spit out a recommendation. Your final product would address the instep issues. 1 hour ago, IPv6Freely said: We're talking about custom. Yes, but you still have to start somewhere. All 3 skates have different fit profiles. It's easier to start at one and go from there. That's why you don't ever see one particular model skate look like another (V-cut being the exception to the rule, that's something else.) The components of the skate still fit that pattern. 30 minutes ago, Cavs019 said: Width most definitely isn’t determined by retail last if that is what you’re suggesting. Pro stock/custom “D” is the same (all else held constant) regardless of which line you select, and has been that way forever. We should probably just wait for the full download from JR/JDub instead of confusing people via speculation. Yes, thanks! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marka 526 Report post Posted July 23, 2018 Howdy, 1 hour ago, Cavs019 said: Width most definitely isn’t determined by retail last if that is what you’re suggesting. Pro stock/custom “D” is the same (all else held constant) regardless of which line you select, and has been that way forever. We should probably just wait for the full download from JR/JDub instead of confusing people via speculation. I thought these teaser things were supposed to generate buzz? We're buzzing! :-) Mark Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vet88 674 Report post Posted July 23, 2018 7 hours ago, strosedefence34 said: Yeah looks to be that way. They have to keep up with CCM and True. I remember when the 3D lab came out someone hinted at the fact that it was going to be used for this in the future. I didn't think it would be a 3D print though. Not just a 3D last (in reality that is dead simple to print from a 3D scan) but imho this is the next step toward a 3D printed boot. Adidas and others are already printing significant components of their footwear range with 3D printers and I've recently seen a new high speed printer that prints carbon fibre. At a technological level everything is there to do it now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VegasHockey 1280 Report post Posted July 24, 2018 (edited) Regardless of how Bauer decides to "make" these "custom" skates their technology is still behind CCM and True until they move to a monocoque frame. I assume that won't happen for a few more years as they need to wait for all of that fancy hardware they bought to depreciate. Edited July 24, 2018 by Nicholas G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stick9 883 Report post Posted July 24, 2018 9 hours ago, Nicholas G said: Regardless of how Bauer decides to "make" these "custom" skates their technology is still behind CCM and True until they move to a monocoque frame. I assume that won't happen for a few more years as they need to wait for all of that fancy hardware they bought to depreciate. Yet they still manage to out sell those other brands, go figure... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
adams2001 54 Report post Posted July 24, 2018 Bauer stepping in to the custom scan/last game is a great thing for us. For me, it gives me options for my next pair of skates since my VHs are running down after 3 years of service. I’m stoked to see how Bauer does with this process and can’t wait to hear feedback on this forum. I’m currently weighing my options on my next pair of customs and I will probably get it started in November. Cant wait to hear from the forum on how well the CCM/Bauer customs are doing. Best hockey equipment news I’ve had since being on this site. IMO, of course. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IPv6Freely 2091 Report post Posted July 24, 2018 I agree. More options is a good thing! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VegasHockey 1280 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 12 hours ago, stick9 said: Yet they still manage to out sell those other brands, go figure... That's because they own the mind share. Look at how many car companies outsell Tesla and Volvo, yet both of those companies are building a superior product. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cavs019 708 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 (edited) By what measure is True a superior product to Bauer? Objectively speaking. Edited July 25, 2018 by Cavs019 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IPv6Freely 2091 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 3 minutes ago, Cavs019 said: By what measure is True a superior product to Bauer? Objectively speaking. At this point? Comfort. But I suppose that’s not an objective measure since plenty of people skate without pain in Bauer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flip12 711 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 5 hours ago, Cavs019 said: By what measure is True a superior product to Bauer? Objectively speaking. What I'd love to know. Not just with True but also CCM's monocoque boots. I wish there were better reviews detailing the degree of benefit that offers. Is it pure hype, somewhat of an improvement, or purely perception, etc.? Maybe there are some LTRs I've missed, but I've tried to look for that info and it keeps eluding me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bunnyman666 445 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 10 hours ago, Cavs019 said: By what measure is True a superior product to Bauer? Objectively speaking. 5 hours ago, flip12 said: What I'd love to know. Not just with True but also CCM's monocoque boots. I wish there were better reviews detailing the degree of benefit that offers. Is it pure hype, somewhat of an improvement, or purely perception, etc.? Maybe there are some LTRs I've missed, but I've tried to look for that info and it keeps eluding me. One would say that the monocoque boot provides a performance advantage in the fact that the outsole is not a separate piece from the boot. It could be seen as more of your movement going to the holder and runner, essentially. This would be from continuous fibres surrounding your foot. That is a subjective argument, as well since after all- if multiple pieces were that bad, the monocoque boot would have made its appearance long ago and nobody would be using Bauer skates (how they are currently made), however- if Bauer ends up making their own monocoque skate, then it would prove if nothing else, they don’t want to be left behind. Now- if someone could build what would essentially an orthotic with a holder attached (yes- an upper would have to be built around it, etc., etc.),that would be a game changer, albeit VERY expensive. To define “orthotic with a holder attached” would be that the skate would be built to a mould of your foot and there would not be a removable insole; the insole WOULD be the footbed and outsole. A few pairs of super-high end cycling shoes are made like this, costing a couple of thousand dollars. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stick9 883 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 12 hours ago, Nicholas G said: That's because they own the mind share. Look at how many car companies outsell Tesla and Volvo, yet both of those companies are building a superior product. Let me guess, you own a Volvo and want a Tesla or you own a Tesla and the wife drives a Volvo. Either way, bet I am close. Not sure you could have picked a worse analogy. For the sake of the thread I’ll just leave it at that. FYI - sold me S60 about 5 months ago. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IPv6Freely 2091 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 34 minutes ago, stick9 said: Let me guess, you own a Volvo and want a Tesla or you own a Tesla and the wife drives a Volvo. Either way, bet I am close. Not sure you could have picked a worse analogy. For the sake of the thread I’ll just leave it at that. FYI - sold me S60 about 5 months ago. I have a Volvo XC90 and just ordered my Model 3, so... does that count? 🙂 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CigarScott 132 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 2 hours ago, bunnyman666 said: Now- if someone could build what would essentially an orthotic with a holder attached (yes- an upper would have to be built around it, etc., etc.),that would be a game changer, albeit VERY expensive. To define “orthotic with a holder attached” would be that the skate would be built to a mould of your foot and there would not be a removable insole; the insole WOULD be the footbed and outsole. A few pairs of super-high end cycling shoes are made like this, costing a couple of thousand dollars. Based on Coach Jeremy's video, the True skates have some orthotic functions built it, at least the bed is built around your arch. I hope this is the case as I just ordered a pair and have to wear orthotics in my shoes. I'm hoping that I don't have to send the right boot back if it makes my pronation/subination issues worse. *fingers crossed* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IPv6Freely 2091 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 That’s correct, it’s shaped to your arch. If you wear orthotics in your shoes you can tell them about it and they’ll build the skates so you don’t need orthotics in them. At least, that’s how it was with VH. I have no idea if they still do that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bunnyman666 445 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 8 minutes ago, CigarScott said: Based on Coach Jeremy's video, the True skates have some orthotic functions built it, at least the bed is built around your arch. I hope this is the case as I just ordered a pair and have to wear orthotics in my shoes. I'm hoping that I don't have to send the right boot back if it makes my pronation/subination issues worse. *fingers crossed* They do build around your arch; it’s just still not quite an orthotic with a holder on it! They still have a superior fit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CigarScott 132 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 I don't know if this link will open for you all but this is the Bauer 3D scan that I got. It recognizes how wide my feet are and it underestimates the length of my feet. It wants me to go into a Vapor eventhough I had to have my 12EE Nexus skates widened as they were too narrow. I was measured in a Bauer Brannock device at was right at size 12 in my left foot. My right foot is smaller but there's no way in hell it's a 9 3/8 skate size as their scanner measures; it may be an 11. I got this and other funky results from the CCM scan which is why I went with True as their process seemed more thorough and included photos in a brannock and photos with hotspots notated. https://my.volumental.com/en/bauer/9f2011d6-46b3-4751-8f7b-5d1e86237a73/?utm_medium=myvemail Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stick9 883 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 Ahem... there’s already a thread for those things. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VegasHockey 1280 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 1 hour ago, IPv6Freely said: I have a Volvo XC90 and just ordered my Model 3, so... does that count? 🙂 I have a new XC60 and a Tesla Model S. I think it counts 😉 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VegasHockey 1280 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 (edited) 3 hours ago, bunnyman666 said: One would say that the monocoque boot provides a performance advantage in the fact that the outsole is not a separate piece from the boot. It could be seen as more of your movement going to the holder and runner, essentially. This would be from continuous fibres surrounding your foot. That is a subjective argument, as well since after all- if multiple pieces were that bad, the monocoque boot would have made its appearance long ago and nobody would be using Bauer skates (how they are currently made), however- if Bauer ends up making their own monocoque skate, then it would prove if nothing else, they don’t want to be left behind. Now- if someone could build what would essentially an orthotic with a holder attached (yes- an upper would have to be built around it, etc., etc.),that would be a game changer, albeit VERY expensive. To define “orthotic with a holder attached” would be that the skate would be built to a mould of your foot and there would not be a removable insole; the insole WOULD be the footbed and outsole. A few pairs of super-high end cycling shoes are made like this, costing a couple of thousand dollars. I think the technology has existed for a while now and manufacturers wanted to move to a single piece skate for a while but it was cost prohibitive. 2 hours ago, stick9 said: Let me guess, you own a Volvo and want a Tesla or you own a Tesla and the wife drives a Volvo. Either way, bet I am close. Not sure you could have picked a worse analogy. For the sake of the thread I’ll just leave it at that. FYI - sold me S60 about 5 months ago. I own both. They are also the only manufacturers that have true full self-driving capabilities but have them currently disabled due to government regulations. In many ways, my XC60 Drive Pilot system works better than Tesla Auto Pilot. I also do engineering, specifically focusing on AI, ML, and HPC. The analogy makes sense if you follow technology in automobiles understanding who is investing the most in safety and advanced driving concepts. 34 minutes ago, bunnyman666 said: They do build around your arch; it’s just still not quite an orthotic with a holder on it! They still have a superior fit. While the arch is somewhat incorporated if you have a high enough arch you will still need an aftermarket footbed of some type. Edited July 25, 2018 by Nicholas G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
althoma1 574 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 4 hours ago, bunnyman666 said: One would say that the monocoque boot provides a performance advantage in the fact that the outsole is not a separate piece from the boot. It could be seen as more of your movement going to the holder and runner, essentially. This would be from continuous fibres surrounding your foot. That is a subjective argument, as well since after all- if multiple pieces were that bad, the monocoque boot would have made its appearance long ago and nobody would be using Bauer skates (how they are currently made), however- if Bauer ends up making their own monocoque skate, then it would prove if nothing else, they don’t want to be left behind. Now- if someone could build what would essentially an orthotic with a holder attached (yes- an upper would have to be built around it, etc., etc.),that would be a game changer, albeit VERY expensive. To define “orthotic with a holder attached” would be that the skate would be built to a mould of your foot and there would not be a removable insole; the insole WOULD be the footbed and outsole. A few pairs of super-high end cycling shoes are made like this, costing a couple of thousand dollars. KOR had a non-removable moldable footbed in a monocoque boot about 12 years ago. Now the boot itself wasn't built around your foot, but you did stand up during the heat molding process and the built in insole would mold around your foot along with other parts of the skate. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marka 526 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 Howdy, 2 hours ago, CigarScott said: I don't know if this link will open for you all but this is the Bauer 3D scan that I got. It recognizes how wide my feet are and it underestimates the length of my feet. It wants me to go into a Vapor eventhough I had to have my 12EE Nexus skates widened as they were too narrow. I was measured in a Bauer Brannock device at was right at size 12 in my left foot. My right foot is smaller but there's no way in hell it's a 9 3/8 skate size as their scanner measures; it may be an 11. I got this and other funky results from the CCM scan which is why I went with True as their process seemed more thorough and included photos in a brannock and photos with hotspots notated. https://my.volumental.com/en/bauer/9f2011d6-46b3-4751-8f7b-5d1e86237a73/?utm_medium=myvemail That's crazy cool! I got scanned a while back just to see, but I didn't know you could get that first page of info at all or that there was an option to have it on the web... Super cool to see level of detail on the first page. Mark Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CigarScott 132 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 Pure Hockey has just advertised the prices for custom skates from all three manufacturers: https://www.purehockey.com/support/customskates/pg_id/60153?contact_eid=63e3fa0e-0f9f-4ef2-a4dc-f80c51da9ad4&utm_source=bm23&utm_medium=email&utm_term=Better+Fit.+Better+Performance.&utm_content=Better+Fit.+Better+Performance.&utm_campaign=PH+-+Product+Launch+-+CCM+Custom+Skates+-+7/25&_bta_tid=02948280735476430312850232155120121274176283516034060117768464330230588970487075630021033433740863786759 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BlueNux 17 Report post Posted July 25, 2018 (edited) 48 minutes ago, CigarScott said: Pure Hockey has just advertised the prices for custom skates from all three manufacturers: https://www.purehockey.com/support/customskates/pg_id/60153?contact_eid=63e3fa0e-0f9f-4ef2-a4dc-f80c51da9ad4&utm_source=bm23&utm_medium=email&utm_term=Better+Fit.+Better+Performance.&utm_content=Better+Fit.+Better+Performance.&utm_campaign=PH+-+Product+Launch+-+CCM+Custom+Skates+-+7/25&_bta_tid=02948280735476430312850232155120121274176283516034060117768464330230588970487075630021033433740863786759 I was just about to post this! Anyway, the Pure Hockey email that was just sent out had a teaser photo of potentially what the custom Bauer will look like. EDIT: NVM. Goalie skates. 😞 Edited July 25, 2018 by BlueNux Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites