BenBreeg

Then sell it and buy a ProSharp Home!!!!!! Have you ever managed a product? Do you know what goes into it? There are myriad explanations why you are seeing this discrepancy.

Neal Peart uggg.

So two years ago I was coming off an almost 10 tear spell where I didn’t play much, just coached. So once I started up again I found I needed to replace some gear. These were replacing an old pair of Vapor elbows that really wouldn’t stop sliding down. I am 6’3”, 180 lbs so on the thin side, was looking for an elbow that would be fairly low profile and would stay in place. I play mainly regular invite-only games so while the games have a good pace, you don’t have to worry about getting hacked or slashed. Protection is mainly for stray shots or getting tangled up with someone and going down here and there. Fit I have these in medium. They have the inner sleeve and a forearm and biceps strap. The elastic sleeve is nice, I wear short sleeves so, it is right against my skin. Because I am thin the biceps area isn't tight but the sleve does seem to help keep it in place and is snug in the forearm and right at the elbow. The 360 strap on the forearm lets you get the tension right where you need it. The three piece design means your elbow goes right into that pocket and keeps it there. 8/10 Protection Again, I don’t play in a contact or chippy league, but because of the fit, I never have to adjust them like I used to. Being in the proper spot contributes to protection. I have gone down here and there and this is a case where if you don’t notice, it is a good thing so I am assuming it is doing its job. It provides full coverage around the forearm and the elbow cap is substantial without being bulky. 9/10 Weight The Vapors I had were pretty light, these are on par. I don’t notice them so I have no complaints here. 10/10 Durability So far they are holding up well. I average about two games a week and have had them about a year and a half. The only thing is as you would expect the elastic on the 360 degree strap is getting a bit relaxed but not enough that it affects the tension. This is an area I will be paying attention to as there is nothing to hold it in place except friction. I keep expecting it to slide off the front edge but so far it hasn’t. The rest of the elbow shows no sign of wear. 7/10 Intangibles I was looking for comfort and something that stayed in place, and these provide that. As an intangible I think the STX Surgeon equipment looks great with the gray, black and white. Doesn't matter much for protective stuff but just my opinion. 9/10 Conclusion I am really happy with this purchase. I think STX is bringing great equipment at very reasonable price points. Once my son gets a bit bigger I will be buying STX for him and will be getting shins for myself next. 8/10

I still have Turk Custom+ and I cannot get the blade to move at all. I don’t think you would have to be a pro level skater to notice, but I could be wrong. I can’t imagine my blade shifting and not being aware.

Empirical data? You mean like somebody’s observations who works in the field full-time at a high level? You’re in luck then...

Mechanical watches actually tend to lose time in higher temps and gain when it gets cold, but it would have to be cold enough for all the internals to get cold and remain that way long enough to gain time.

Ever see Crosby’s stuff? Old and practically falling apart. On Spittin’ Chicklets I think he said his jock is the same since juniors, which if actually kind of gross but to each their own. During I think the last All-Star game they showed him getting dressed and you could see the repairs on his elbows and shoulder pads which looked to be ancient. He said he hates to change gear.

I have always seen it as a very general starting point, and that the flex would be the net flex, not stick flex. So the flex once it was cut.

Why not try some of that orange adhesive remover, it is pretty gentle. Or Magic Eraser or what about just carefully blacking it out with a permanent marker?

The 3D mold is going to mirror the shape of your foot, but not the combination of hard and softer structures, nor can it account for the sensitivities of various parts of your foot in respect to the pressure the skate is applying. And I echo the question, what is the point? A lot of conclusions or suggestions being thrown about based on questionable observations...

Don’t get the equation that more equals better. Classic patterns will always trump stuff that is too busy to me. Some say lazy, I say restrained.

Agree, those Grafs are for me the best looking skates ever. The all white with the white toe cap eventually look like someone did a bad spray paint job and it is coming off.

I am the opposite. I think skates have gotten too gaudy. Love the basic black. We had silver and grey Vapors and Nike’s, they look dated.

That isn’t what he said.

We have a work from home arrangement, nice to not have to use PTO when you are sick. Plus it does keep things from spreading. Of course with my wife working in a school and two kids in school that is cancelled out by all the plagues they bring home...

Good luck! We just got one three months ago. He whimpered in the crate the first night but after that nights have been good. Jumping and being mouthy, not so much....

I have been trying the Pearsox Ultralite and Thinees. The Thinees are soft like cotton but still synthetic. The do pill a bit but doesn’t affect performance The Pearsox are standard nylon like cheap dress socks. They can feel a little rough but seem to be softening a bit. Their sizing is out of whack though. I am 6’3” with an 11 1/2 foot. The adult size comes halfway up my thigh. I can wear the intermediate but the youth also fits fine. The mite is too big for my son, too much material in the foot for his size 2 1/2 foot so he wears the Thinees.

Oh, so pros can get an older style constructed boot made to look like a modern model?

Dumb question but what is a tech mesh skate?

In that pic in caveman’s post his 70ks have 11.

Another point is that your skating biomechanics encompass your whole body. The alignment of everything from your head to your shoulders, hips and knees plays a huge part in how force is transmitted through the foot into the skate and then the blade to the ice. So the foot is kind of the last part of this chain. With a stiff skate, given perfect biomechanics up to that point allows efficient and controlled energy transfer to the ice, but it doesn’t fix flaws. The thing the no lace skating gives you in addition to the strengthening already discussed is feedback, magnified responses to adjustments you make as you do drills. Move your knee a little bit, change how you rotate your shoulders, etc. Here is a related article that references how Miro Heiskanen ties his skates. https://www.dallasnews.com/sports/stars/2019/08/20/finland-loose-laces-and-dull-blades-how-stars-defenseman-miro-heiskanen-developed-into-an-elite-skater/ Again, once you have all those components, a stiffer boot can ensure nothing is being lost because of the boot, but it is not the cure. Here is an Athletic article talking mainly about forward flex but also about potential energy leak from lateral sloppiness, although there aren’t any real citations for the work they did, maybe I will Google and see if those are publicly available. https://theathletic.com/696003/2018/12/07/the-nhls-best-young-skaters-all-have-something-in-common-how-they-tie-their-skates/

Certainly could be, I just thought it interesting that she brought it up almost 20 years ago.

Some interesting points, Laura Stamm has an article on her website way back in 2001 cautioning against the general skater getting in too stiff a boot. As for the pros using stiff skates, getting back to the car analogy- Once you are a great driver you can squeeze every bit of performance out of a 900 HP F1 car but if you or I got in it would be a hinderance to learn the skills of racing and driving. Better skaters like pros have good edge control and can leverage the modern boot.

Yeah, you are right, each has their own goals. But the OP did inquire about the ideal stiffness of skates which I would assume implies that the ideal stiffness would lead to better skating. So the response led to something along the lines of the dominant variable not being the skate but the path to quickest improvement would be concentrating on technique. Like you said, to each his own. I love breaking things down in anything I do and really getting into the details. Others may not.

I would say this about the analogy, nobody said crap skates, but the relative minutiae between one good enough pair of skates and another good enough pair of skates isn’t going to matter much to a beginner. i think the better analogy may be, given a basic vehicle that is good enough, the better driver is going to win the race.