Custom CCM skates vs. Custom True Skates

[iceman8310 105]

I had a pair of VH skates via the tracing process.  Now that both companies scan, how is the process between the CCM vs. The True?  Is one more accurate than the other?  I was very happy with my VH but I've heard/read that there has been more issues with the True.  Is the CCM process any better?  Is the CCM Full custom actually full custom?

Edited December 11, 2018 by iceman8310

[VegasHockey 1280]

8 hours ago, iceman8310 said:

I had a pair of VH skates via the tracing process.  Now that both companies scan, how is the process between the CCM vs. The True?  Is one more accurate than the other?  I was very happy with my VH but I've heard/read that there has been more issues with the True.  Is the CCM process any better?  Is the CCM Full custom actually full custom?

They both use the same software to scan.

CCM basically takes a scan and prints a copy of your foot and matches it to a retail skate boot and then does a high-pressure mold of the skate around a copy of your foot. 

True takes the scan and builds the skate from the inside out, around the foot last. 

Which is better, I think they are both excellent compared to buying any traditional skate off the retail shelf. The best skate is the one that matches your skating style while also proving a good fit. We get many people who come in and ask us whats better, CCM, Bauer or True for custom skates and I always have the same answer, it's whatever you prefer. 

[adams2001 54]

I just made the switch from VH customs to CCM (FT1) full custom. 

Wait time: About the same. I waited about 6 weeks from scan to delivery. 

Fit: Very close, the wrap isn’t the same but there are some benefits that ccm offers that VH did not. The stiffness being the main advantage along with boot length selection. The feel is similar with the one piece construction. The boot quality is much better along with the looks (objective) and weight. 

Recommendation: I went with ccm because my VHs were starting to wear down after 3 years of use. 

What sold me on CCM customs was the one piece construction, reputable brand name, and the thought of trying something new. 

The one piece feel is there, you definitely get a more traditional skate in the eyelets though.

The transition hasn’t been crazy but there are subtle nuances here and there. 

 

I would recommend ccm customs for sure. 

[parsley 2]

4 hours ago, Nicholas G said:

They both use the same software to scan. 

CCM basically takes a scan and prints a copy of your foot and matches it to a retail skate boot and then does a high-pressure mold of the skate around a copy of your foot.  

True takes the scan and builds the skate from the inside out, around the foot last. 

Which is better, I think they are both excellent compared to buying any traditional skate off the retail shelf. The best skate is the one that matches your skating style while also proving a good fit. We get many people who come in and ask us whats better, CCM, Bauer or True for custom skates and I always have the same answer, it's whatever you prefer.  

Isn't the CCM option you're referring to the (cheaper) 3D Custom Mold option? I thought the Total Custom option from CCM was a "built from scratch" process, ala True?

[strosedefence34 175]

17 hours ago, Nicholas G said:

They both use the same software to scan.

CCM basically takes a scan and prints a copy of your foot and matches it to a retail skate boot and then does a high-pressure mold of the skate around a copy of your foot. 

True takes the scan and builds the skate from the inside out, around the foot last. 

Which is better, I think they are both excellent compared to buying any traditional skate off the retail shelf. The best skate is the one that matches your skating style while also proving a good fit. We get many people who come in and ask us whats better, CCM, Bauer or True for custom skates and I always have the same answer, it's whatever you prefer. 

 

12 hours ago, parsley said:

Isn't the CCM option you're referring to the (cheaper) 3D Custom Mold option? I thought the Total Custom option from CCM was a "built from scratch" process, ala True?

@Nicholas G is only referring to one form of "custom" skates where they make a 3D print of your foot and bake a pair of Tacks.  There is a fully custom option (http://www.jerryshockey.com/ccm-3d-fit-scanner-custom-skates , https://www.sportsetc.net/news/hockey-equipment/new-ccm-3d-hockey-skate-scanner , http://www.paynesportssales.com/customskates/ )for CCM as well where you can do different quarters, tongues, liners, ankle foams ect.

[boo10 323]

CCM custom mould option is also 10% more expensive than True.  Both CCM and Bauer full customs are 35% more expensive than True.

(Based on $CAD pricing at Pro Hockey Life).

Edited December 12, 2018 by boo10

[marka 526]

Howdy,

Does True create a 3d mold based on your foot scan?  I'd heard that they just pick a last from an already existing selection that's closest to your foot shape.

It would be nice to know if that is actually the case or not.

Mark

[Giltis 116]

1 hour ago, marka said:

Does True create a 3d mold based on your foot scan?  I'd heard that they just pick a last from an already existing selection that's closest to your foot shape.

From the conversation that I've had with a current True employee, they have confirmed that they create a custom last from the 3D scan for your foot and your foot only.

Edited December 12, 2018 by Giltis

[lslcs4lif 1]

1 hour ago, Giltis said:

From the conversation that I've had with a current True employee, they have confirmed that they create a custom last from the 3D scan for your foot and your foot only.

I have heard the exact opposite of this. 

[Giltis 116]

43 minutes ago, lslcs4lif said:

I have heard the exact opposite of this. 

Not to sound accusatory, but I'm curious as to where you have heard this. 

The reason I had contacted True in the first place was to exactly to address this rumour that I had read online from a different Hockey forum. I wish a verifiable employee would come on here to explain.

[lslcs4lif 1]

13 minutes ago, Giltis said:

Not to sound accusatory, but I'm curious as to where you have heard this. 

The reason I had contacted True in the first place was to exactly to address this rumour that I had read online from a different Hockey forum. I wish a verifiable employee would come on here to explain.

Not accusatory at all, I think there is a ton of confusion about how each company makes their skates. I agree, I'd love for someone to come on here and explain for all 3 brands to clear up the confusion. 

If you look at True's website, they clearly state that the skate is "Built from the inside out using a custom 3D foot last built to the individual skater's foot"

But what exactly does that mean? Does that mean they use the stock last that fits closest to the players foot and add pieces to it (like i've heard) or is a new last created for each player as I feel is suggested by that wording? 

 

Edited December 12, 2018 by lslcs4lif

[strosedefence34 175]

17 hours ago, lslcs4lif said:

I agree, I'd love for someone to come on here and explain for all 3 brands to clear up the confusion. 

 

1

I would love to see 3 pinned topics with a format similar to the reviews section where the comments are monitored and have to be approved prior to going into the thread for all 3 custom options so the misinformation and speculations get cleared up. The issue is who is going to monitor the threads?  It has to be someone who knows the process of the 3 manufactures and I think that's too much to ask of someone to do. 

Edited December 13, 2018 by strosedefence34

[mojo122 535]

Probably going to be hard to find someone with expert knowledge of all 3 manufacturers who is unbiased towards all 3.

[flip12 715]

They wouldn’t have to be unbiased, their bias could just be moot by being removed from the conversation by the format: their role could be entirely factual, to the degree that they want to discuss their particular skates’ production, they could confirm, deny or clarify. Any bias they wish to add could be moderated by an impartial moderator from MSH...letting the fox into the coop, but on a leash, so to speak.

[VegasHockey 1280]

On 12/12/2018 at 7:21 AM, strosedefence34 said:

 

@Nicholas G is only referring to one form of "custom" skates where they make a 3D print of your foot and bake a pair of Tacks.  There is a fully custom option (http://www.jerryshockey.com/ccm-3d-fit-scanner-custom-skates , https://www.sportsetc.net/news/hockey-equipment/new-ccm-3d-hockey-skate-scanner , http://www.paynesportssales.com/customskates/ )for CCM as well where you can do different quarters, tongues, liners, ankle foams ect.

 

On 12/12/2018 at 8:30 AM, boo10 said:

CCM custom mould option is also 10% more expensive than True.  Both CCM and Bauer full customs are 35% more expensive than True.

(Based on $CAD pricing at Pro Hockey Life).

Correct, I was only referring to the typical custom process because I was trying to keep pricing as close as possible between CCM, Bauer and True skates. Of course, you can go full custom, but the price then changes dramatically between True and the other brands. Like I said, going custom, regardless of which brand you choose, is going to be better than grabbing a retail skate off the shelf. As long as you pick a skate that matches you skating style you should be fine. Personally, the CCM scanner recommended the AS1 for my foot, which I know for a fact is wrong, and also put me in a size 8D. I wear a 7.25 EE in a Vapor or Jet Speed and the same in True, if you go by measurements. Just for giggles I let CCM build the AS1 as the scan recommended and I found the skate was overall too long and stiff for my skating style. So I think the shop doing the fitting needs to provide some input into what fits and will work best for the player regardless of the brand of custom skate you select. The pair of FT1 skates I had made custom fit like a glove and have been very nice. I will soon have a pair of the Vapor 2x Pro skates when they release and will be able to compare all of the different brands. As it stands right now, I use my true skates more than any other pair I own as they are more comfortable and I get much better edge control with them based on the position they place your foot in.

[Stewie 721]

1 hour ago, Nicholas G said:

 

Correct, I was only referring to the typical custom process because I was trying to keep pricing as close as possible between CCM, Bauer and True skates. Of course, you can go full custom, but the price then changes dramatically between True and the other brands. Like I said, going custom, regardless of which brand you choose, is going to be better than grabbing a retail skate off the shelf. As long as you pick a skate that matches you skating style you should be fine. Personally, the CCM scanner recommended the AS1 for my foot, which I know for a fact is wrong, and also put me in a size 8D. I wear a 7.25 EE in a Vapor or Jet Speed and the same in True, if you go by measurements. Just for giggles I let CCM build the AS1 as the scan recommended and I found the skate was overall too long and stiff for my skating style. So I think the shop doing the fitting needs to provide some input into what fits and will work best for the player regardless of the brand of custom skate you select. The pair of FT1 skates I had made custom fit like a glove and have been very nice. I will soon have a pair of the Vapor 2x Pro skates when they release and will be able to compare all of the different brands. As it stands right now, I use my true skates more than any other pair I own as they are more comfortable and I get much better edge control with them based on the position they place your foot in.

If the OP doesn’t list price limits as a factor, than you should always explain all options rather than limiting options when they ask, and specifically when they ask if the process is full custom. 

[IPv6Freely 2092]

1 hour ago, Nicholas G said:

CCM custom mould option is also 10% more expensive than True.  Both CCM and Bauer full customs are 35% more expensive than True.

What is the difference between "CCM custom mould" and "CCM full custom"? 

[boo10 323]

15 hours ago, IPv6Freely said:

What is the difference between "CCM custom mould" and "CCM full custom"? 

Custom mould is exactly what it sounds like, a retail skate pressure moulded to a 3d last of your foot.  A full custom is made to measure (quarter sizes, different left/right sizes, tongue options, quarter facing options, etc.).

Edited December 14, 2018 by boo10

[IPv6Freely 2092]

Got it. Thank you.

I wonder when Bauer will start doing that with goal skates and/or when CCM will start making cowlingless goal skates. At this point I'm stuck with True (which I'm okay with... )

True definitely seem to be even more popular with NHL goalies than they are with skaters. Last I saw its still a pretty significant % of them wearing True. 

[Leif 161]

I don’t know if Bauer do a full custom in the sense of a tailor made suit, but they do fit the length and width of each foot independently with length adjusted in 1/4 size steps, and then use heat and pressure to mould each skate to a custom machined last. My Bauer customs fit like gloves, and a friend’s Bauer custom goalie skates also fit perfectly. I know another person who will pick up his Bauer customs when he returns from working in Russia, and I’ll ask him what he thinks. The only issue I had was that they are better with the standard insoles rather than the Speedplates, possibly because the latter are a bit thicker. I suspect I would be happy with CCM or True, but Bauer custom was realistically my only option, the True dealer being a five hour drive away compared to 35 minutes for the Bauer LHS. As far as I know CCM custom are not available in the U.K. 

Edited December 14, 2018 by Leif

[VegasHockey 1280]

4 hours ago, IPv6Freely said:

Got it. Thank you.

I wonder when Bauer will start doing that with goal skates and/or when CCM will start making cowlingless goal skates. At this point I'm stuck with True (which I'm okay with... )

True definitely seem to be even more popular with NHL goalies than they are with skaters. Last I saw its still a pretty significant % of them wearing True. 

CCM will have a new Jet Speed goal skate in April without a cowling. 

[VegasHockey 1280]

2 hours ago, Leif said:

I don’t know if Bauer do a full custom in the sense of a tailor made suit, but they do fit the length and width of each foot independently with length adjusted in 1/4 size steps, and then use heat and pressure to mould each skate to a custom machined last. My Bauer customs fit like gloves, and a friend’s Bauer custom goalie skates also fit perfectly. I know another person who will pick up his Bauer customs when he returns from working in Russia, and I’ll ask him what he thinks. The only issue I had was that they are better with the standard insoles rather than the Speedplates, possibly because the latter are a bit thicker. I suspect I would be happy with CCM or True, but Bauer custom was realistically my only option, the True dealer being a five hour drive away compared to 35 minutes for the Bauer LHS. As far as I know CCM custom are not available in the U.K. 

Bauer will also do a full custom, but it costs more than retail custom. Just like CCM full custom, you fill out the specs on a spreadsheet and can change things like facing length, stiffness ratings, and more. 

[oldtrainerguy28 478]

17 hours ago, Nicholas G said:

 

Correct, I was only referring to the typical custom process because I was trying to keep pricing as close as possible between CCM, Bauer and True skates. Of course, you can go full custom, but the price then changes dramatically between True and the other brands. Like I said, going custom, regardless of which brand you choose, is going to be better than grabbing a retail skate off the shelf. As long as you pick a skate that matches you skating style you should be fine. Personally, the CCM scanner recommended the AS1 for my foot, which I know for a fact is wrong, and also put me in a size 8D. I wear a 7.25 EE in a Vapor or Jet Speed and the same in True, if you go by measurements. Just for giggles I let CCM build the AS1 as the scan recommended and I found the skate was overall too long and stiff for my skating style. So I think the shop doing the fitting needs to provide some input into what fits and will work best for the player regardless of the brand of custom skate you select. The pair of FT1 skates I had made custom fit like a glove and have been very nice. I will soon have a pair of the Vapor 2x Pro skates when they release and will be able to compare all of the different brands. As it stands right now, I use my true skates more than any other pair I own as they are more comfortable and I get much better edge control with them based on the position they place your foot in.

I'm not sure how this doesn't answer the question asked. Pretty much sums it up. 

[strosedefence34 175]

30 minutes ago, oldtrainerguy28 said:

I'm not sure how this doesn't answer the question asked. Pretty much sums it up. 

@oldtrainerguy28 we were talking about how this post did not fully answer the question the op posted.

On 12/11/2018 at 5:14 PM, Nicholas G said:

They both use the same software to scan.

CCM basically takes a scan and prints a copy of your foot and matches it to a retail skate boot and then does a high-pressure mold of the skate around a copy of your foot. 

True takes the scan and builds the skate from the inside out, around the foot last. 

Which is better, I think they are both excellent compared to buying any traditional skate off the retail shelf. The best skate is the one that matches your skating style while also proving a good fit. We get many people who come in and ask us whats better, CCM, Bauer or True for custom skates and I always have the same answer, it's whatever you prefer. 

12 hours ago, Leif said:

I don’t know if Bauer do a full custom in the sense of a tailor made suit, but they do fit the length and width of each foot independently with length adjusted in 1/4 size steps, and then use heat and pressure to mould each skate to a custom machined last. My Bauer customs fit like gloves, and a friend’s Bauer custom goalie skates also fit perfectly. I know another person who will pick up his Bauer customs when he returns from working in Russia, and I’ll ask him what he thinks. The only issue I had was that they are better with the standard insoles rather than the Speedplates, possibly because the latter are a bit thicker. I suspect I would be happy with CCM or True, but Bauer custom was realistically my only option, the True dealer being a five hour drive away compared to 35 minutes for the Bauer LHS. As far as I know CCM custom are not available in the U.K. 

As far as I understand for the mybauer custom skates if you ask for increase quarters or more ankle padding in the notes of the scan it is something bauer will do for you.  It is not just a stock boot with different lengths and width. See @JDub post here on page 7 and scroll down a little he answers some of these questions. And as @Nicholas G stated you can always go with traditional bauer customs the way they were done prior to the 3D scans. Usually, that's about $100 on top of the cost of a retail skate.

 

 

Edited December 14, 2018 by strosedefence34

[Leif 161]

Obviously MyBauer aren’t stock boots, but I’m interested to know how the default boot differs from stock, beyond the customisation listed byJDub. I don’t think you can ask for specific changes to the boot behind those listed by JDub, for example he states that the scan takes care of the width. I was asked if i wanted to add any notes, which I think is designed to help Bauer avoid problem areas such as a bulbous ankle. I did see some skates for someone with bulbous ankles, and the skates matched the scan. I can see that stock skates would have been a poor fit for that person. 

One question I have is whether or not the Bauer scan allows for the footbed, and if so whether it also allows for the Speedplates which are a little thicker than the standard footbeds. I would expect they do, and I wonder if it is added in when they make the last.