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marka

TRUE TF9/TF7 skates

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21 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

There must be a true europe email you can contact who would be able to sell and ship you the tongues. I know you can in NA.  I'm lucky in that my LHS has them in stock. 

You also can get some Nash Sniper tongues and just sew some loop velcro on them and put them on. I know it sucks to have to do it on new skates. Maybe a cheaper method would be to just get some gel lacebite pads and out them under the tongue. 

 

At their website i choose Europe in region and under contact it says info@true-hockey.com. Luckily they just responded to my e-mails this morning, i'm going to see what comes of that. 

Thanks for tip with the Nash Sniper tongues, might be something worth looking into if True doesn't come thru.

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On 8/31/2020 at 9:26 PM, marka said:

Howdy,

So, for you guys using/fitting these things... Are you finding that @Hills is right and they fit a half size bigger than "normal"?  I.e. that if you wear an 8.5 commonly, you want an 8 in the retail Trues?

Mark

I bought the same size as my CCM (8.5W) and it's hard to tell if it's the right length prebake because of the insert they put in the the toe cap. It's supposed to be there so that you can adjust it a half a size or so. I'm not sure if that makes the boot longer than normal and the insert makes it the proper size or if it makes it smaller than what the size is. Currently my big toe kind of sits on top of the insert. 

Have you guys taken the insert out or left it?

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On 9/1/2020 at 9:35 AM, IPv6Freely said:

I do also wonder if at some point Bauer and CCM will start making skates that also absolutely must be baked to fit them correctly as well. There still seems to be a significant chunk of the population that still thinks baking skates is just to help them break in faster.

Are there people that don't bake their Bauer or CCM's??? Yikes...

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6 hours ago, calixguy18 said:

I bought the same size as my CCM (8.5W) and it's hard to tell if it's the right length prebake because of the insert they put in the the toe cap. It's supposed to be there so that you can adjust it a half a size or so. I'm not sure if that makes the boot longer than normal and the insert makes it the proper size or if it makes it smaller than what the size is. Currently my big toe kind of sits on top of the insert. 

Have you guys taken the insert out or left it?

Depends on how much of your toes you wan brushing up against the toe cap. Some like it not to touch at all. Some like it to feather. And some like it more or less "jammed". 

You should take the footbeds out and stand on that to see how sizing is. The footbeds length is a really good indicator of the length unless the footbeds is too small or too large for the boot (which I've seen in the past with true customs, but nothing recent?). For me true has pretty much been size 7 for my left foot and 6.5-6 to 3/4 for my right.  I know this bc I use Bauer speed plates in them and the size 7 SP fits the left boot perfect but the right I have to trim close to the 6.5. 

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On 9/1/2020 at 8:31 AM, Sniper9 said:

I think one of the reasons true is having this promo right now is to get people to try their skates that are hesitant. I'm confident (and I'm sure they are) that a lot of people will find them one of the most comfortable fitting skates they have worn. 

I suspect they're on sale as a standard Labor Day sale. Everything else is... If the timing works out for them, all the better. 

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14 hours ago, calixguy18 said:

I bought the same size as my CCM (8.5W) and it's hard to tell if it's the right length prebake because of the insert they put in the the toe cap. It's supposed to be there so that you can adjust it a half a size or so. I'm not sure if that makes the boot longer than normal and the insert makes it the proper size or if it makes it smaller than what the size is. Currently my big toe kind of sits on top of the insert. 

Have you guys taken the insert out or left it?

I didn't notice the insert in the stock skates. Just the customs. I reached in and nothing was easily to remove like they are in the customs.

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2 hours ago, Hills said:

I didn't notice the insert in the stock skates. Just the customs. I reached in and nothing was easily to remove like they are in the customs.

The TF9 that I tried on did not have inserts, so either they don't come with them or someone previously removed them.

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3 hours ago, Hills said:

I didn't notice the insert in the stock skates. Just the customs. I reached in and nothing was easily to remove like they are in the customs.

No inserts in the TF7/TF9 

27 minutes ago, boo10 said:

The TF9 that I tried on did not have inserts, so either they don't come with them or someone previously removed them.

No inserts in the TF7/TF9 

Edited by SkateWorksPNW

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I got my 7.0R, 7.0W, 7.5R, and 7.5W skates today. I measure the following in custom skates:

Right Foot
Width: 102 mm
Length: 266.3 mm

Left Foot
Width: 99.7 mm
Length: 261.9 mm

In the TF7 I wear a 7.5W and in the TF9 I wear a 7.0W. I could maybe fit the R width but it was a little tighter than I prefer and I figure once I start skating and my foot swells a little they would likely be uncomfortable. I assume the lower profile tongue of the TF9 allows me to fit into a slightly smaller skate. 

When I swapped the TF9 tongue into the TF7 in a size 7.0 it seems to fit fine. 

All of this testing was done with the skates unbaked and also baked. Baking them changes the fit dramatically. 

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Howdy,

So, sizing...

I currently wear a 7.5D Mako m8.  Comfortable.  I think I have a little more volume than the skate is designed for (I fail the pencil test some), but never had an issue with lace bite.  No issues with heel lift or anything.  My toes don't brush the endcap, but aren't far from it either (if I loosen laces and move my foot forward to check).

The True sizing chart at Ice Warehouse has CM measurements as well.  I traced my feet, then measured (along the center axis of my foot).  Left is 26.5cm, Right is 26.7cm.  On the sizing chart, a 7.5 is 26.4cm and an 8 is 26.8cm.

Given what's been said above, I was figuring I'd be more like a 7...

Fore foot width is 10.8cm on both feet (outside of ball to widest part of the other side, measured horizontally across the tracing)


Recommendations?

Mark
(Mostly I'm just curious here... If I pull the trigger on these I'll almost certainly go to the local KO Sports to do it)

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25 minutes ago, marka said:

Howdy,

So, sizing...

I currently wear a 7.5D Mako m8.  Comfortable.  I think I have a little more volume than the skate is designed for (I fail the pencil test some), but never had an issue with lace bite.  No issues with heel lift or anything.  My toes don't brush the endcap, but aren't far from it either (if I loosen laces and move my foot forward to check).

The True sizing chart at Ice Warehouse has CM measurements as well.  I traced my feet, then measured (along the center axis of my foot).  Left is 26.5cm, Right is 26.7cm.  On the sizing chart, a 7.5 is 26.4cm and an 8 is 26.8cm.

Given what's been said above, I was figuring I'd be more like a 7...

Fore foot width is 10.8cm on both feet (outside of ball to widest part of the other side, measured horizontally across the tracing)


Recommendations?

Mark
(Mostly I'm just curious here... If I pull the trigger on these I'll almost certainly go to the local KO Sports to do it)

The size chart on IW is teh same for all skates. Its not skate or brand specific. 

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20 hours ago, pgeorgan said:

Are there people that don't bake their Bauer or CCM's??? Yikes...

For sure. It's becoming less and less common but there are still plenty of people that think that baking skates does nothing besides help them break in faster and "don't want to wear them out prematurely"

But my comment wasn't really about that so much as just the idea that baking True or Mako was an absolute must to get the fit right. If that ever becomes the same for Bauer and CCM then you won't see stores unwilling to bake before purchase because it will just be normal and generally required. So in some ways, True is being the Apple of the hockey world by being willing to be kicked in the face or bitched about in the process of pushing tech forward (I recall when the first MacBook Airs were obscenely expensive because laptop SSDs weren't really a thing yet, but they bit the PR/backlash bullet and put them in anyway. Prices went down as it became more common, and now we're better off for it in the long run.)

If True can figure out a model where pre-sale baking is sustainable, then it may become commonplace. They just may take a lot of shit in the process, hiccups, etc.

Or it could blow up in their face, True fizzles out or just goes back to custom-only, and we continue on the same path of nothing really changing year to year. If there weren't so many people willing to forgive a bit of a cosmetic nightmare (I never experienced this personally but many many people did) for something that is unbelievably comfortable they'd likely already be dead as a brand. 

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3 hours ago, SkateWorksPNW said:

I got my 7.0R, 7.0W, 7.5R, and 7.5W skates today. I measure the following in custom skates:

Right Foot
Width: 102 mm
Length: 266.3 mm

Left Foot
Width: 99.7 mm
Length: 261.9 mm

In the TF7 I wear a 7.5W and in the TF9 I wear a 7.0W. I could maybe fit the R width but it was a little tighter than I prefer and I figure once I start skating and my foot swells a little they would likely be uncomfortable. I assume the lower profile tongue of the TF9 allows me to fit into a slightly smaller skate. 

When I swapped the TF9 tongue into the TF7 in a size 7.0 it seems to fit fine. 

All of this testing was done with the skates unbaked and also baked. Baking them changes the fit dramatically. 

Position of tongue also affects the fit as well. For my tries, if I place the tongue to where I like it(further into the toe box to reduce space), I had to remove the toe plugs from my skates as my toe felt pressed up against the end. With the tongue pulled out a bit further my toes only brushed when the toe plugs were in. The reason is obviously bc if you have little space to wiggle your toes, it's prone to stay flat and extended vs slightly curled. 

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5 minutes ago, IPv6Freely said:

For sure. It's becoming less and less common but there are still plenty of people that think that baking skates does nothing besides help them break in faster and "don't want to wear them out prematurely"

But my comment wasn't really about that so much as just the idea that baking True or Mako was an absolute must to get the fit right. If that ever becomes the same for Bauer and CCM then you won't see stores unwilling to bake before purchase because it will just be normal and generally required. So in some ways, True is being the Apple of the hockey world by being willing to be kicked in the face or bitched about in the process of pushing tech forward (I recall when the first MacBook Airs were obscenely expensive because laptop SSDs weren't really a thing yet, but they bit the PR/backlash bullet and put them in anyway. Prices went down as it became more common, and now we're better off for it in the long run.)

If True can figure out a model where pre-sale baking is sustainable, then it may become commonplace. They just may take a lot of shit in the process, hiccups, etc.

Or it could blow up in their face, True fizzles out or just goes back to custom-only, and we continue on the same path of nothing really changing year to year. If there weren't so many people willing to forgive a bit of a cosmetic nightmare (I never experienced this personally but many many people did) for something that is unbelievably comfortable they'd likely already be dead as a brand. 

Where are you getting this info? At a minimum, a bake is required to mold the Speed Plates and to get the injected eyelets to conform to the foot. They come out of the box sticking straight up. I'm just not seeing how a bake "does nothing". 

I suspect anyone that doesn't need a bake with Bauer or CCM won't need one with True, either. But hey, to each their own. 

I'm trying on TF9 tomorrow, but suspect it won't fit me well, as I'm not into bulky toe boxes. 

Edited by pgeorgan

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48 minutes ago, pgeorgan said:

Where are you getting this info? At a minimum, a bake is required to mold the Speed Plates and to get the injected eyelets to conform to the foot. They come out of the box sticking straight up. I'm just not seeing how a bake "does nothing". 

I suspect anyone that doesn't need a bake with Bauer or CCM won't need one with True, either. But hey, to each their own. 

I'm trying on TF9 tomorrow, but suspect it won't fit me well, as I'm not into bulky toe boxes. 

Sorry, what info are you referring to? Who is saying a bake does nothing?

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1 minute ago, IPv6Freely said:

Sorry, what info are you referring to? Who is saying a bake does nothing?

It was implied that Bauer and CCM don't "require" bakes and when would they be "requiring" them. The insert and instructions are plastered all over the inside of the box. I guess if True want to mandate them as optimal, so be it. That's sort of implied and obvious at this point with the other manufacturers, perhaps that's why it's not in plain English. 

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27 minutes ago, pgeorgan said:

It was implied that Bauer and CCM don't "require" bakes and when would they be "requiring" them. The insert and instructions are plastered all over the inside of the box. I guess if True want to mandate them as optimal, so be it. That's sort of implied and obvious at this point with the other manufacturers, perhaps that's why it's not in plain English. 

K

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17 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

Depends on how much of your toes you wan brushing up against the toe cap. Some like it not to touch at all. Some like it to feather. And some like it more or less "jammed". 

You should take the footbeds out and stand on that to see how sizing is. The footbeds length is a really good indicator of the length unless the footbeds is too small or too large for the boot (which I've seen in the past with true customs, but nothing recent?). For me true has pretty much been size 7 for my left foot and 6.5-6 to 3/4 for my right.  I know this bc I use Bauer speed plates in them and the size 7 SP fits the left boot perfect but the right I have to trim close to the 6.5. 

I compared the True footbed to the Superfeet from my CCMs and they are almost identical in size and shape. 

6 hours ago, SkateWorksPNW said:

No inserts in the TF7/TF9 

No inserts in the TF7/TF9 

Maybe they aren't removable inserts but there is definitely something in the bottom edge of the toe cap. It feels like it's about 1/2" high and made out of dense foam. I tried to take a picture of it but my phone is too wide to get into the boot. Is that just for comfort?

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Howdy,

6 hours ago, SkateWorksPNW said:

I got my 7.0R, 7.0W, 7.5R, and 7.5W skates today. I measure the following in custom skates:

Right Foot
Width: 102 mm
Length: 266.3 mm

Left Foot
Width: 99.7 mm
Length: 261.9 mm

In the TF7 I wear a 7.5W and in the TF9 I wear a 7.0W. I could maybe fit the R width but it was a little tighter than I prefer and I figure once I start skating and my foot swells a little they would likely be uncomfortable. I assume the lower profile tongue of the TF9 allows me to fit into a slightly smaller skate. 

When I swapped the TF9 tongue into the TF7 in a size 7.0 it seems to fit fine. 

 

Did you notice a big difference in heel width / fit / lift between the regular and wide versions of the same size?

Mark

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True should just do what CCM have been doing for a long time now - offer a 90-day Satisfaction Guarantee. Buy the skates, bake them, use them, whatever. Return them if it's not a good fit. No questions asked.

Trying on a baked skate in the store is only 10% of the picture. I agree it should become part of the fitting process, but you really need to demo the skates. Even the goalie world has figured this out. You can demo any piece of goalie equipment these days, and take shots! 

Either stand behind your product, or don't. 

In other news, I just called my local Pure Hockey - not carrying the skates in stock, despite offering them online. Also not honoring the Labor Day sale.  Good grief.  

Guess I'll just continue to wonder if I'm missing out on anything.

Hey, True, if you're reading this....

Edited by pgeorgan
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2 hours ago, BenBreeg said:

90 day guarantee is great, I used it to get another size for my Ribcores, but you need to be at significant scale for that to be feasible.

Not necessarily. I don't have their balance sheet in front of me, but it's a calculated risk, for sure. Guess they've calculated it's not worth the risk.

If I believed I had a product that was as transformative as their advertisements say, I'd be moving heaven and earth to get it to the market.

On the other hand, if it's just another skate option serving customers that prefer a softer fit, then probably they're banking on people naturally gravitating towards them on their own.

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My guess is it’s a longer view thing, 2 seasons down the road versus pushing every button right now. Word of mouth on Trues here has been excellent. A surprising amount of beer leaguers I talk to wanted True customs but couldn’t justify the price. That all changes now. And that’s potentially another layer of broader word of mouth.

True’s also got some high end prospects in their skates. Once they have a few of the game’s most prominent players, maybe in a few more years, that cements the market incursion. That’s my view of their strategy.

Edited by flip12

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5 hours ago, pgeorgan said:

If I believed I had a product that was as transformative as their advertisements say, I'd be moving heaven and earth to get it to the market.

On the other hand, if it's just another skate option serving customers that prefer a softer fit, then probably they're banking on people naturally gravitating towards them on their own.

Marketing 101...

From experience I find the young players want Bauer or CCM because their favorite NHL Player wears them or because their teammate Johnny does.  Older players who have always skated in Bauer or CCM and haven't had any issues tend to stay in that skate.  

Mako was a niche skate and True might just remain that as well.

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I agree with @flip12, by going custom and targeting top end players, their exposure is becoming significant thru NHL games. In these playoffs, it seems every play I see has someone in True skates. And whilst it may not be your favorite NHL player in them, there are enough now that it generates exposure and brand awareness. Now it comes down to the LHS experience and this may be where they fail, the customer facing side still only wears Bauer or CCM and even though True is in store, they don't really get pushed. Now if every shop employee wore True skates then I suspect the in store experience would be very different.

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