Remember ModSquadHockey?

[JGraz15 53]

I have been the biggest fan of ModSquadHockey since day 1. I came over from Corebeam. I loved visiting this site...finding out about the latest gear and talking with other fanatics while getting expert insight into the little details we all care about.

This week Bauer officially debuted their new Supreme skate and CCM released the new Tacks skate and helmet. I came over here to read reactions...crickets. What has happened? Is the market stagnant and no one cares anymore? There hasn't been a product review in a year and a half or a new catalog in over 2 years. 

What does the community see as the future here? Sorry if this is posted in the wrong section

 

 

[Ogie Oglethorpe 14]

COVID - we have to stay 6 ft away from new products

(plus rinks are just starting to open again; wouldn’t have had an opp to test it)

[chanxebyshev 8]

2020 so effed up we can't keep track

What's this steel? Pulse Ti?

Do I get a HR monitor and titanium 😍

[Stewie 721]

I guess not enough people have their own private rinks to test out the new skates. 
 

not a lot of people have their mind on hockey right now, as many rinks still will be closed for a while. 

Edited May 31, 2020 by Stewie

[Cavs019 708]

To be fair - gear has stagnated completely and either innovation is at an all time low, or we’ve reached a point of diminishing returns on currently available materials.

I have a hard time getting excited about CCM moving their logo from the bottom of the Ribcore shaft to the top, or Bauer adding different pops of chrome every year and calling it a new stick. Protective hasn’t really gone anywhere in about 8 years since the CL line released and skates, aside from steel/holder enhancements haven’t really gone anywhere aside from perhaps better baking results. 

We’ve also seen a decline in unique products. We’ve been P92/P28/P88’ed to death and quirky stuff like custom Franchise gloves have completely disappeared.

Did I also mention that all of this stuff has been increasing in price at an absurd rate? It’s hard to generate buzz when there is nothing to buzz about. /rant. 

Edited May 31, 2020 by Cavs019

[VegasHockey 1280]

1 minute ago, Cavs019 said:

To be fair - gear has stagnated completely and either innovation is at an all time low, or we’ve reached a point of diminishing returns on currently available materials.

I have a hard time getting excited about CCM moving their logo from the bottom of the Ribcore shaft to the top, or Bauer adding different pops of chrome every year and calling it a new stick. Protective hasn’t really gone anywhere in about 8 years since the CL line released and skates, aside from steel/holder enhancements haven’t really gone anywhere aside from perhaps better baking results. 

We’ve also seen a decline in unique products. We’ve been P92/P28/P88’ed to death and quirky stuff like custom Franchise gloves have completely disappeared.

Did I also mention that all of this stuff has been increasing in price at an absurd rate? It’s hard to generate buzz when there is nothing to buzz about. /rant. 

I agree with all of this. As player who also owns multiple hockey stores and also does team sales I think we have hit a point where the only innovations are decreases in weight. The problem is the materials they are incorporating to decrease weight by such a very minimal margin are also making equipment less durable and more costly.

The good news is that the second or third from the top price points are now just as good as the top of the line product from a year or two ago. So anyone thats not playing at a ridiculously high level no longer needs to buy top of the line sticks and such to get a high quality product. 

For example, the new AS3 skate is very nice and I don't see many people wanting to spend the money on an AS3 Pro unless they are wanting to go custom. Otherwise it seems like a poor investment, unless you are getting it for cost, your team is paying for it, or you have money laying around and want to waste it. I think other companies such as TRUE are also recognizing this as well with their retail strategy. 

Lastly, the market has been flooded with pro stock items so even if you want to go with a top of the line product you can usually find it the very same thing in pro stock with equal or better specifications for significantly less than retail. There is an equipment manager for a WHL team that sells a ton of stuff on the side and he has made my life miserable for some time now. Why would anyone spend $250 on a top of the line stick when they can get the same stick in a pro stock model from him for $100? 

[BenBreeg 493]

My thoughts as someone who is in product development and plays and has a young son playing.

-The “innovation” is so incremental in many areas as to be meaningless.

-They still haven't nailed the skate fit problem.  It is confusing to consumers and the weak link is the value chain, store employees often don’t know what they are talking about.  At the same store my son got fit by someone who knew what he was doing while I got the dunce.  

-Too few brands honestly, it makes things less interesting to me.  You get similar design language from the big players in all their stuff.  I remember when there were still a lot of other players listed in the Great Skate, Ocean, Kemps, etc catalogs.

[DarkStar50 679]

Watch a vintage game from 20 years ago or more on NHL Network now and just look at all the brands that are gone. Each brand drove the others to innovate and punch through the envelope back then. Now ? Not so much. The access to Pro Stock is also another pipeline that has effected everyone in the chain.

[caveman27 208]

On 5/30/2020 at 10:27 AM, JGraz15 said:

I have been the biggest fan of ModSquadHockey since day 1. I came over from Corebeam. I loved visiting this site...finding out about the latest gear and talking with other fanatics while getting expert insight into the little details we all care about.

This week Bauer officially debuted their new Supreme skate and CCM released the new Tacks skate and helmet. I came over here to read reactions...crickets. What has happened? Is the market stagnant and no one cares anymore? There hasn't been a product review in a year and a half or a new catalog in over 2 years. 

What does the community see as the future here? Sorry if this is posted in the wrong section

People who are able to afford the latest gear haven't been reviewing gear.

I usually buy clearance items so reviewing something that isn't going to be produced anymore doesn't have a lot of use.

[Burning Bear 76]

16 hours ago, Cavs019 said:

Did I also mention that all of this stuff has been increasing in price at an absurd rate?

This, for me, is a really big part of it. I realize inflation has a hand in it to some extent, but I remember 15 years ago when gloves like the Vapor XXX were selling at around $129.99 I think? Fast forward to the present day when the 1X Lite retails for $219.99 (not counting the recent markdown on account the 2X line set to hit the market soon). Have gloves really come that far so quickly that they're worth nearly double the price? Not in my eyes, at least.

As for things like sticks, they're expensive in general for what they are. I don't mind paying a high price for something that feels good, performs well, and lasts me for a reasonable period of time, but when I shell out top dollar on something like the 1X Lite I bought a few years ago that dies after just a few months playing once or twice a week, I don't feel like I got good value for my money. I normally always shoot for top-of-the-line gear because I like the idea of a product being made as good as it can be, but I haven't felt comfortable paying more than $200 for a stick since.

This is to say nothing for those who pay top dollar only to have the stick snap on them and be SOL because the warranty expired just a week beforehand. It's hardly a wonder people load up on pro stock sticks at $100. I'm sure sticks aren't cheap to make and the profit margins are slim even on the higher-end, but I also don't like the idea of pointing the blame at consumers just trying to get their money's worth and people selling pro gear on eBay just hoping to make a little pocket change on the side. I feel bad for retail stores who end up being punished as a result of all this, but maybe it's not a great business model in general? I don't know. Someone feel free to step in and correct me on any of that.

Anyway, to get back on topic, rinks are closed, people aren't working, the economy is screwed, a virus is running rampant, and the streets of major US cities are filled with a whole lot of anger and hate. I wish I could say I was spending a lot more time worrying about hockey (among many other things) right now, but the world is a very different place than it was three months ago.

[steve66 45]

I think in terms of getting reactions to the latest gear, people have migrated to different places on the interwebs.... Reddit, facebook groups, Instagram. I've noticed that whilst not always the first with the latest breaking announcements, MSH still remains somewhere for reasoned thoughts and opinions, not just a string of emojis, knee jerk reactions and a list of their favourite colour.

With regards to buzz around equipment, I still for one am as excited as ever for new gear. Those most recent products announced are awesome, and knowing what is coming, Hockey gear has never been better. Granted you could say that top end is too expensive, and not durable enough, but that's what it is, it's performance gear. High end performance cars are expensive and not particularly durable, but they're the best at what they offer in terms of performance. Moving back to Hockey gear, the second and mid price points are also better than ever in terms of performance, durability and feel. I think it's easy to look at the top price point, criticise the industry and overlook these awesome products. 

[colins 246]

 

When everyone gets back to the rinks I imagine it'll have a direct impact on the volume of discussion here.

Personally, I've been looking more at inline and ABS blade info lately, strictly due to circumstances. Focus is on off ice training/practice opportunities and that doesn't need much in terms of the usual on ice equipment.

I'm using my Sparx beer koozies daily, but my sharpener not so much 🙂

[start_today 770]

Modsquad always slows down in the summer. That combined with lack of both NHL hockey and local adult leagues, I think we are in an exagerated lull right now. I agree with the comments on  stagnating innovation and price. 

Hopefully things bounce back once play resumes. We can rebuild it, we can make it better! 

—

The choice of color splash on the Supremes is very similar to what CCM did with the CLs 10(?) years ago. 

[the_game 452]

Can I get my new Bauer skates with a P91 Curve on the Tendon Guard instead of the P28 curve pictured?

[stick9 890]

On 5/31/2020 at 1:30 PM, caveman27 said:

People who are able to afford the latest gear haven't been reviewing gear.

I usually buy clearance items so reviewing something that isn't going to be produced anymore doesn't have a lot of use.

Everyone eventually gets to a point where they are set with what they have. So while they may be in a position to afford new gear, they aren't buying it cuz they are still happy with what they have.

I couldn't agree more with the plateau in tech. IMO, I think modern era skates are as good as they are going to get. Same goes for sticks. Protective.....why bother. Really, the only area for new tech is helmets. But, stubborn ass hockey players want their Bauer 4500 and its crusty ass foam because it looks good.

I'll leave some of the other stuff be.

Edited June 1, 2020 by stick9

[218hockey 50]

I can't see adult players getting that excited about equipment unless you play enough to actually wear gear out.

I'm on here because I have a child that normally plays eleven months a year. We really go through the equipment. I'm almost always buying top of the line gear but it's never current model.

We broke a 1N and 1S sticks this past winter and went from size 4.5 1S skates in October, to 5.5 2S Pros in December. Now we suddenly have ice, both teams we're involved with are practicing, and I'm scrambling for I think 7.5 or size 8 skates! So to me the equipment cost is really a big concern. I still can't go out and buy new top of the line skates even at the second mark down. But hey, we just bought a new 2S Pro stick for $125. I guess stuff is so expensive now I feel like I got a great deal.

I've never bought any pro stock equipment. As far as skates go, I avoid it on purpose. Too hard to know what you're getting.

Edited June 2, 2020 by 218hockey
spell

[chippa13 1844]

The reason for the perceived "slow down" on MSH these last few months is because nobody is playing or watching hockey right now. Nobody has seen anything to get excited about. On top of that, for many people hockey is extremely far down the list of priorities as they deal with the pandemic, home offices and home schooling, work uncertainty, and unemployment through no fault of their own with no end in sight. I am one of the lucky ones that can work from home and doesn't have to deal with educating children or caring for older relatives. Many don't have that same luxury so we'll have to excuse them if they aren't doing cartwheels over the latest Bauer reveal.

The broader topic of less catalog reviews and the like is due to the shift in the industry. With manufacturers taking a firmer hold on when and how their new product is dropped, there is less opportunity for pre-launch buzz. MSH enjoys a positive relationship with the manufacturers and isn't about to jeopardize that. With their embracing of social media, manufacturers want to control their message and timing of information and MSH respects that.

[Neo5370 132]

As a member, what do I get out this positive relationship with manufacturers?  Not trying to be disrepectful.  Ive been a long time member as well and have found myself coming here less and less.  I think ive been compelled to post or reply maybe 3 or 4 times in the last few years. 

 

[BenBreeg 493]

A CCM rep is posting in one of the skate threads, other reps have chimed in from various companies.  But again, equipment IMO is in a period of diminishing returns.  In the last year I would say discussions around profiling/pitch have been of the most interest to me.  Various people with some pretty deep knowledge chimed in and various research studies were referenced and posted.  To each their own.

[Neo5370 132]

Reps post on reddit now too.  

[beerleaguecaptain 999]

I have to be honest, I find the topic you chose for this thread to be offensive - or at least overly provocative.  There is a man behind the site that works incredibly hard for this community and that should always, in ,my opinion, be remembered.  You could have just as easily asked the question, "why isn't more information about products being posted on MSH"  This would have been valid and far nicer.

As many have said the market has changed considerably.  The way manufacturers deal with online information outlets has changed as well.  I also think the way people consume news and information has changed and many prefer to listen to a video rather than write and discuss.  I could get into what that says about us as people (not a good thing) but I will pass on it.  Low hanging fruit as it were....

The good thing is we can do things to help....   post good topics.  Share your experiences and reviews.  Tell your friends about the site and, when the pandemic is over, come to events.

In the end this site is what WE make of it.

[BenBreeg 493]

1 hour ago, Neo5370 said:

Reps post on reddit now too.  

You asked, I answered.  I didn’t say they posted exclusively.  Message boards are made up of members interacting.  If you are looking for discussion, start a thread and contribute something.

[chikinpotpie 137]

2 hours ago, dkmiller3356 said:

I have to be honest, I find the topic you chose for this thread to be offensive - or at least overly provocative.  There is a man behind the site that works incredibly hard for this community and that should always, in ,my opinion, be remembered.  You could have just as easily asked the question, "why isn't more information about products being posted on MSH"  This would have been valid and far nicer.

As many have said the market has changed considerably.  The way manufacturers deal with online information outlets has changed as well.  I also think the way people consume news and information has changed and many prefer to listen to a video rather than write and discuss.  I could get into what that says about us as people (not a good thing) but I will pass on it.  Low hanging fruit as it were....

The good thing is we can do things to help....   post good topics.  Share your experiences and reviews.  Tell your friends about the site and, when the pandemic is over, come to events.

In the end this site is what WE make of it.

Hear hear!

Edited June 4, 2020 by chikinpotpie
Proper spelling of hear

[IPv6Freely 2092]

23 hours ago, Neo5370 said:

As a member, what do I get out this positive relationship with manufacturers?  Not trying to be disrepectful.  Ive been a long time member as well and have found myself coming here less and less.  I think ive been compelled to post or reply maybe 3 or 4 times in the last few years. 

 

You get interaction with reps. You get the opportunity to test gear. You get to see and demo product at events. You get to be a member of a place with some integrity when it comes to product leaks.

Ultimately, you get plenty more than what you’re paying for.

As for the topic, I avoided touching it but since @dkmiller3356 posted his thoughts, I will too.

Part of the reason it’s slow is lack of hockey being played.

Part is the lack of interesting products to talk about.

Part of it is that people are consuming information in other ways. Short YouTube clips, Instagram and Facebook (and for the Gen-Z’ers, tiktok).

Part of it is that people don’t have the patience for a medium where you ask a question and aren’t likely to get a response in a couple hours, possibly days or longer. People these days NEED A REPLY RIGHT NOW.

And finally, a big part of it (in my opinion) is that we chose to maintain our integrity and keep our content to information and less “shitposting”, pardon the expression. Anyone who has ever been on GGSU or any hockey Reddits know what I’m talking about - those places are super busy but they’re also absolute cesspools. I was (well, technically still am I guess) a member, and former admin, on another hockey forum that was specifically for goalies. They had easily 3-4x our traffic, but also 3-4x less actual information. It was mostly made up of off topic nonsense, memes, GIFs, and general trash. But it was without a doubt busy. Is that better to have more traffic but less content?

There are likely other reasons as well that nobody is going to get into publicly because it’s both not my place and frankly it’s none of anyone else’s business either.

If you want more content, then post some. Don’t expect everyone else to do it for you. You certainly can’t count on me to do it because I don’t follow gear outside of goalie stuff anymore.

Like Dave said, this site is what you make of it. 

[ParabolicActivity 48]

I use old threads here for a resource all of the time but I almost never say anything here because the vibe is super negative. Im excited about new gear. I love talking about it. But every thread here turns into inane off topic bickering. It's such a bummer. The old stuff is great though. I wasn't here for it but I see why you would miss how it used to be here.