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1 hour ago, Hills said:

Sorry... but if your buddy is scanning in at 1.5 sizes BIGGER than the Bauer scan... I am not trusting what your friend is saying on how his skates fit.

Yeah. Something here doesn't make sense. 😕

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6 hours ago, pgeorgan said:

My buddy got scanned for Bauer 6.5 EE and went with 8 TF9. Claims his toe just touches the tip. YMMV. 

Was coming from (poorly) fitting Grafs. Says the fit is "10x better". 

TF9 8 R or W? What size and make Grafs was buddy wearing?

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6 hours ago, Hills said:

Sorry... but if your buddy is scanning in at 1.5 sizes BIGGER than the Bauer scan... I am not trusting what your friend is saying on how his skates fit.

Buddy's wearing 1.5 bigger now, sounds like. Maybe the X and Y were reversed at scan time?

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11 hours ago, Hills said:

The amount of people that mention how comfortable their skates are and how they fit better but are basically wearing boats is amazing. I had a woman online tell me she was in a 5.5 True and wears a 6.5 Woman's shoe... For comparison Breezie on this site wears a 7.5 Woman's shoe and a 4 skate.

It depends on which is your longest toe. Those who have a second toe that's longest will fit into a diff size than those with a big toe that's longer, bc if you look at the toe cap it's rounded. For example a person who's a size ten bc their big toe is the longest, is different than someone who fits a size ten because their second toe is the longest. The big toe will brush the toe cap in the area where it starts to curve. Second toe longest will brush the toe cap where it's leveled off at its longest distance from the heel.  That's prob why there's some discrepancy where some ppl go down anywhere from 1.5-3 sizes in skates. It all has to do with which longest toe brushes which part of the toe cap vs in their shoes, and the tow box area of skates are quite diff than shoes. 

Edited by Sniper9
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I can understand this for 1/2 sizes but in some cases we are talking 2 or 3 sizes out. Given a size is around 1cm, I've yet to come across anyone who has a toe 3cm's longer than any others! My personal experience with this (fitting skates for many years) is a misguided belief around comfort, to quote - "I chose that size because the skates didn't hurt when I laced them up". This is because they are so long and wide there are no pressure points on those little foot bits that don't quite fit within a retail skate profile. 

As to comparing shoe size to skate size, one of my great bug bears in life. Everyone wears shoes differently and shoe manufacturers still don't follow consistent sizings, I just don't get why this keeps getting repeated verbatim instead of - your feet measure 26cms long so you start with a size 6. 

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36 minutes ago, Vet88 said:

I can understand this for 1/2 sizes but in some cases we are talking 2 or 3 sizes out. Given a size is around 1cm, I've yet to come across anyone who has a toe 3cm's longer than any others! My personal experience with this (fitting skates for many years) is a misguided belief around comfort, to quote - "I chose that size because the skates didn't hurt when I laced them up". This is because they are so long and wide there are no pressure points on those little foot bits that don't quite fit within a retail skate profile. 

As to comparing shoe size to skate size, one of my great bug bears in life. Everyone wears shoes differently and shoe manufacturers still don't follow consistent sizings, I just don't get why this keeps getting repeated verbatim instead of - your feet measure 26cms long so you start with a size 6. 

Oh you're totally right. I was just suggesting why there are some ppl who wear skates 2 sizes smaller in skates and some 1.5. The huge discrepancies are 🤔. And you're totally right about the shoe size being a bad guide bc of diff manufacturers, and the fact that a lot of ppl also wear shoes that are the wrong size/ have a diff preference of how they want their shoes to fit. 

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8 hours ago, Vet88 said:

As to comparing shoe size to skate size, one of my great bug bears in life. Everyone wears shoes differently and shoe manufacturers still don't follow consistent sizings, I just don't get why this keeps getting repeated verbatim instead of - your feet measure 26cms long so you start with a size 6. 

This is so true.  I'm always baffled when someone posts that they wear a size 10 shoe and a size 7 skate.  Well if a size 7 skate fits properly, your shoes are too damn big then. 

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9 hours ago, IPv6Freely said:

If only we could just start using mm for shoe AND skate sizing, life would be so much easier.

They do this for snowboarding boots and it theoretically makes life so much easier, but you still get a ton of people with oversized boots because they don’t know any better and just buy whatever is on sale online. 

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51 minutes ago, start_today said:

They do this for snowboarding boots and it theoretically makes life so much easier, but you still get a ton of people with oversized boots because they don’t know any better and just buy whatever is on sale online. 

Don't forget people believe "comfortable" to mean you can't feel the sides or the toes at all.

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1 hour ago, start_today said:

They do this for snowboarding boots and it theoretically makes life so much easier, but you still get a ton of people with oversized boots because they don’t know any better and just buy whatever is on sale online. 

Well I guess if they do that, then having an accurate size doesn't matter for those people in the first place, so whatever.

22 minutes ago, Hills said:

Don't forget people believe "comfortable" to mean you can't feel the sides or the toes at all.

Yep. I've been wearing shoes too big for most of my adult life. It wasn't until I started wearing good dress shoes that I realized it. Explains why I started in size 9 skates. 

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7 minutes ago, IPv6Freely said:

Yep. I've been wearing shoes too big for most of my adult life. It wasn't until I started wearing good dress shoes that I realized it. Explains why I started in size 9 skates. 

I have a buddy who works at a high-end suit store and he said 90% of new customers that buy dress shoes realize their whole life they have been wearing the wrong size sneakers and such. It's not until they come into his store to buy an expensive pair of dress shoes and are properly fitted that they realize the whole time they should have been in a significantly smaller shoe.

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15 hours ago, Sniper9 said:

It depends on which is your longest toe. Those who have a second toe that's longest will fit into a diff size than those with a big toe that's longer, bc if you look at the toe cap it's rounded. For example a person who's a size ten bc their big toe is the longest, is different than someone who fits a size ten because their second toe is the longest. The big toe will brush the toe cap in the area where it starts to curve. Second toe longest will brush the toe cap where it's leveled off at its longest distance from the heel.  That's prob why there's some discrepancy where some ppl go down anywhere from 1.5-3 sizes in skates. It all has to do with which longest toe brushes which part of the toe cap vs in their shoes, and the tow box area of skates are quite diff than shoes. 

In shoes and skates, the toe box is usually the issue, especially on my right foot. My big toes are the longest and I've had some otherwise great fitting footwear that cause almost unbearable pain on my right big toe because I'm stubborn enough to wear the shoes in. With Graf, I can comfortably fit a 10 if it's a wider forefoot skate, like the 501 or 701, but the 703 is just a tiny bit too compressed at the outer tip of my right big toe. With the 9.5 TF7s I found I could feather the cap, but my toes didn't feel compressed by either the length or the width of the toe box. It's a roomy design without feeling cavernous, maybe because the TF7 has that thicker tongue and I didn't try on TF9s.

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7 hours ago, boo10 said:

This is so true.  I'm always baffled when someone posts that they wear a size 10 shoe and a size 7 skate.  Well if a size 7 skate fits properly, your shoes are too damn big then. 

I wear size 9 shoes. Size 8 is painful. I wear size 6.5-7 (Bauer) and size 8 (Powerslide) inline skates, and size 7 (Bauer) stock ice skates, or 6.5 (L) and 6.75 (R) custom ice skates. The skate sizes just don’t make sense unless you use Mondopoint ie mm, in which case they are consistent.

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This whole thing is so complex. I wear size 11.5 sneakers, sometimes 11E depending on the cut off the sneaker. I wear a 10E dress shoe. My longer foot measures 29.2cm and the shorter is 28.8 or 28.9cm. According to all the charts that would put me in a 10.5 Bauer skate. However, my feet are very flat so when I measure them on flat ground they are longer. But when I put them in skates the arch picks up the foot a bit and shortens it overall. Practically, I wear a 9E skate or a 9.5D depending on volume and width etc. Size 9= 27.7cm, 9.5=28.1cm. my point being that even pure measure of the feet in cm or mm can be mistaken. Best is an experienced fitter and someone who can coach you in how a skate should feel. I had a coach come with me when I was younger and he literally squeezed my foot in different places and explained to me how to describe different sensations on the foot when I put on a boot. Then I tried something on and I would describe it how he taught me and he was able to explain of it was ok or if it was an issue and if it could be resolved or not. And even after that, I have still bought skates that weren't a perfect fit and errors have still been made. It's not an easy job at all. And my feet have changed over the years due to growth, injuries, weight gain and other factors too. And brands have changed their skate lasts and sizing. So even once you think you have it down, it changes again. There's no one size fits all ( pun intended) solution

Edited by Miller55

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Guys, can we move back on-topic about True TF7/TF9 skates? There are already a million topics about skate sizing on here.

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On 10/1/2020 at 11:22 AM, stick9 said:

Sounds like his current skates may have been a little tight or poorly fitted and his new skates are too big. Could be one of those who add length to compensate for lack of width. 

Well, a EE in a Bauer is usually like a D in a 1/2-size higher. So Figure 7D Bauer vs 8D in the TF9. I was there for the bake.

Its not totally out of the question...

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On 10/1/2020 at 4:15 PM, flip12 said:

Buddy's wearing 1.5 bigger now, sounds like. Maybe the X and Y were reversed at scan time?

Idk what to tell you. I was there for the Bauer scan and for the TF9 bake at Pure Hockey.

Perhaps the problem is with the Bauer scanner.

Personally, I doubt he's a 6.5EE. He'd be better off with a 7 Fit2. Could he fit into a Tf9 R size 7.5? Maybe. Not everyone wants the smallest possible skate imaginable. We're talking beer leagues, after all. 

He likes them a lot and he can skate just fine. He's not wheeling up the ice or anything. 

Edited by pgeorgan

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Had a chance to try on the TF9 over the weekend and I gotta say, fit for me was nearly spot on...just a few small hotspots that I’m pretty sure can be punched out.  Had to go down a half size which is nice since it puts me into a jr boot and an extra $200 savings which makes them an even better deal than they already are.

Now the negatives(for me).  I just didn’t like the thin stock tongue.  I was surprised because usually this kind of thing doesn’t bother me and I’m fine with whatever typically comes stock.  The nice thing is the boots have a good amount of depth so it should be no problem if I want to swap out to a thicker felt tongue.  Not sure if I missed it earlier in the thread but has it been confirmed that you’re able to order felt tongues from True?

The other negative for me is along with going down a half size in the boot comes a smaller holder, 246, than I’d like(used to 254, and even 263).  Just kind of threw me off.  But again, should be a simple fix if the larger holder will fit on the boot.

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@th6252You should be able to up-size the holders afterwards. Most brands do it on EE widths.

I had 246's on my vapors, which are now converted to inline. If I ever switch them back, it will be to 254. 

Edited by stick9

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1 hour ago, stick9 said:

@th6252You should be able to up-size the holders afterwards. Most brands do it on EE widths.

I had 246's on my vapors, which are now converted to inline. If I ever switch them back, it will be to 254. 

Yeah, I assume the holder thing is a fairly easy fix for a competent shop to do, but (not that I pretend to know much a swapping holders) it didn’t seem there was much real estate on the outsole go go bigger.

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1 hour ago, th6252 said:

Yeah, I assume the holder thing is a fairly easy fix for a competent shop to do, but (not that I pretend to know much a swapping holders) it didn’t seem there was much real estate on the outsole go go bigger.

It's rarely a problem to go with an oversized holder. I have seen 280 holders mounted on size 6 skates. 

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3 hours ago, th6252 said:

Yeah, I assume the holder thing is a fairly easy fix for a competent shop to do, but (not that I pretend to know much a swapping holders) it didn’t seem there was much real estate on the outsole go go bigger.

It's weird to think there wasn't much room to get a holder one size up to fit since the boot itself should technically be about the same as as your previous skates. Going half a size down in trues would only mean their boots are overrated for it's size .. which confuses me why their size 6.5 skates require a 254 holder if in theory their 6.5 is the same length as ccm or Bauer 7 which uses a 263 holder 

Edited by Sniper9

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3 hours ago, SkateWorksPNW said:

It's rarely a problem to go with an oversized holder. I have seen 280 holders mounted on size 6 skates. 

Good to know thanks!

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